Most of the fans that I’ve spoken have questions that the current group of reporters have not asked.
We have 2 Juco highly regarded OG’s and a redshirt freshman 4 Star OG. Why are they not good enough to beat out a converted DL and a transfer with a severely swollen ankle? Were their evaluations of those Juco players wrong? Did the redshirt freshman not develop or is there a failure in coaching?
If one of our DE has a bad hand why after 8 weeks is that an excuse if we are so deep on the DL?
Maybe Richard can explain why no one is asking these questions since I’m sure more people than just me would like to know.
Don’t know about reporters, but Juco’s are always iffy. Few move in and become productive but some have one very good year, but a lot of them never do much. Some schools do not even try to sign Juco’s. And occasionally one moves in and has a very good career, but most do not. There is usually a reason they are in a Junior College. For every Cam, there re ten busts.
If the Jucos can’t come in and start why take them, there is a reason they went the Juco route. I know we have had some that came in and helped,but usually you have to break thier bad habits,plus they were probably the big dog on campus and get humbled pretty quick once introduced to the Sec west teams. Catching lightining in a bottle doesn’t happen very often,just soon have a good quality hungry freshman. WPS
The vast majority of football players go the Juco route due to their grades in high school not qualifying them for major college football scholarships. A year or two of working to get better grades in Juco, they are then eligible for scholarship with whatever playing eligibility they still have left.
Have you people already forgot Spaight and Tretola? They were Juco. Arkansas has had a lot of Jucos contribute heavily over the years. Bielema and this coaching staff are just striking out now evaluating or developing these Jucos as the OP insinuates. They have struck out big time all down that O-Line to an abysmal extent.
Unfortunately, that is both JUCO and HS. Dudley said on here the other day CBB was looking to sign 4 maybe 5 OL. So, I was interested in how many he signed (5 in a year seems high). When I looked he has signed 16, the service I looked at had Froholdt as a DL (17), and Raulerson not listed because he is a transfer (18). I can’t blame Anderson, his first year and he’s had to convert a Dlineman and use a B12 transfer who couldn’t beat out other B12 lineman at his old school. The OL recruits this year will be on him, hopefully they’re better.
You can look back over those signing classes of 2013 & 2014, and see all the busts that create this O-Line dilemma in 2016. Josh Allen, Johnathan McClure, Reeve Koehler, Ryan Gray & Jovan Pruitt all bust from those two years. Nobody from the previous class of 2012 which would be fifth year men with that always desirable lineman red-shirt ever contributed to this team as O-Lineman ever even in years past. Just too many losses. Bielema picked too many people that either couldn’t or wouldn’t help this program. He must do better.
2012, two OL recruits. Only one I remember playing in a game, he graduated. 2013 was 5 (although Gray was a walk-on, so I wouldn’t count him). Two played, two busts. 2014 4 recruits, 2 studs (Tretola, Ragnow) 2 current starters (Wallace, Ragnow), and a miss, Pruitt. So, out of 10, 6 played. Not sure I’d blame those classes. I blame CBB, Kirkland, Tretola, Skipper, Ragnow were going to be gone last year, and this year, he should have had someone from the 2015/2016 classes that could have taken their place. Can’t blame 2012-2014. He knew what he had (5 studs, 5 duds), he should have got people to replace them.
There are only three scholarship O-Lineman left on that whole squad from the 2012, 2013 & 2014 recruiting cycles, Brian Wallace, Frank Ragnow and Dan Skipper. All three start. It is hard to have success in the SEC with lower class fresh & soph lineman starting. I know Alabama gets the Shawn Andrews types regularly but at Arkansas they are rare as hen’s teeth. We must develop linemen and Bielema must pick people that are capable and will stick with the program.
Bielema is going to have to beat what he is doing or he will be fired. Alabama, LSU and Texas A&M out recruiting him does not buy him a permanent residence as Razorback head coach as you homers dream. Find some other good old boy to dream about.
2012: Two OL recruits (both graduated)
2013: 5 OL recruits (1 JUCO graduated, 2 still here, 1 the stud we usually don’t get, and one walk-on that left after one year) so 3 will graduate, 1 Kirkland went pro after JR year, I say they stayed
2014: 5 OL recruits (1 JUCO graduated, 3 still here, 1 academically enelgible and never reported.
So, out of 12 guys, 4 graduates, 5 still here, 1 left as a JR to go pro, 1 never made it to campus. Think you guys are wrong on this.
2013: McClure JUCO graduate, Kirkland, Koehler, Skipper, Gray (walk on one year)
2014: Tretola JUCO graduate, Wallace, Ragnow, Allen (all on 2016 roster), Pruitt (failed to qualify)
This coach has already took this program through its lowest point it has been since before I was born. I was born in the early 1950’s. Last Saturday he hit another low point with a pitifully prepared defense that gave up more rushing yards than had ever been given up in Razorback history. I don’t like to see this program being drug through a gutter. Bielema keeps doing that. They can not get rid of him too fast for me. I am a Razorback fan. Not the fan of some millionaire coach doing a bad job. You homers just don’t seem able to ever sweep out coaching trash.
I don’t quite understand all the intricacies of your post. You seem to be saying Koehler & Allen are still on the team roster and I guess scholarship too. I was not aware of that, it didn’t show on my source, but then it is still my mistake if you are right. Sorry for putting something false on the board. Whatever, we apparently don’t have enough able bodies to properly man that O-Line.
War, you ain’t the only one saying this. I understand that people want to come up with the reason, and it’s easy to say 12-14. Now, I’ll agree with OL, in 2012, Petrino only recruited two, one of those two never played (maybe practice squad), but 13-14 had 10 guys. 6 are still here, 2 graduated, one never made it to campus, and the walk on decided one year was enough.
Ill be honest I didn’t realize Koehler and Allen was still here either. If you go to 247 and click on 2013/2014 commit list, then on their names it says Arkansas Razorbacks 2016 active roster. So, that surprised me too.
My original point was that it wasn’t the 12-14 class that is the issue. By this year (2016) recruiting period, CBB knew who could play and who couldn’t. There is a reason a B12 transfer and an DL are starting on the line. CBB knew who could play and who couldn’t. He should have went after guys that were ready now, be it freshmen or JUCO’s. This is all on him.
There are 19 total players from the 12-13 classes still on the roster, 14 get significant playing time, either as a starter or 2 deep. It’s not those classes that were or are the problem.
As for the original question, is the media doing their job, yes. There job is to get us excited about the team. They did that.
Edit: Koehler and Allen are not here, 247 is incorrect. Koehler transferred to JUCO, Allen was kicked off team this past Spring.
I fully blame Bielema for the present O-Line situation as well. I didn’t mean to infer otherwise by apparently falsely alleging several O-Lineman had left the program. You cannot always be succinct in meaning on these boards like a face to face discussion.
I agree with you on the role of the sports media. They work with these coaches in the interest of presenting positive sports entertainment. Not as news beat reporters digging for facts through hell & high water. You go at Bielema face to face like we do on these boards. It would be hell & high water. We have anonymity with our opinions however harsh. Very easily yielded behind a computer screen.
You responded before my edit. Koehler and Allen are no longer here, my source 247 was incorrect. Koehler transferred to JUCO (?) and Allen was dismissed by CBB. Wasn’t trying to be an arse. If you can see the football Insider board, this is my response over there:
Said: We don’t have 4th and 5th year guys. Players ain’t staying.
12 guys from the 2012 from the 12-13 classes went pro. Of those 12, 1 Mekale McKay transferred. 3 left early by going pro. 8 went pro after exhausting their eligibility.
17 (said 19, was counting Koehler and Allen) are still here. 14 are getting significant playing time. So, the JR’s, SR’s are staying. 17 are on course to graduate. 14 are significant players. I can say names, and you’ll be like, yep correct.
We have guys staying. The issues isn’t with those classes. It’s with the 14,15,16 classes. CBB didn’t get guys to replace the 29 that are going to exhaust eligibility. For some reason people on here expect those 29 to stay, 25 did.
I don’t have access to the Football Insider board. These discussions can easily descend into a cacophony of numbers with all the changing course possibilities within an NCAA restricted 85 member college football team. This discussion has definitely became that cacophony and I apologize for being the one to initially send it in that direction.
Concerning my stating the Hogs only had three offensive lineman still on scholarship from the 2012, 2013 & 2014 recruiting classes. Those being Brian Wallace, Frank Ragnow & Dan Skipper. I got that info from a young adult nephew in the northeast US, I called him yesterday. He is long removed from Arkansas but he follows the Hog program as a devotee of deep religion. I would just about swear by anything he says about the Hogs. Never seen him wrong on a techno Hog issue like this ever before.
Anyway back to my original premise, the Hogs only have three upper class scholarship O-Lineman on their entire 85 member football roster. That is not good on paper and we are seeing it demonstrated in the worse way on the football field. The old saying you are as strong as your weakest link like a chain is certainly true in football. This situation is all Bielema’s fault. We do seem to agree fully on at least that.
I read back over this thread. Bake, I see the the approach that you are taking on this Hog O-Line weakness issue. You are saying the failure to retain & develop O-Lineman from years back (2012, 2013 & 2014), does not play as big a part in 2016 O-Line weaknesses as the failures to rectify this situation by Bielema in the 2015 & 2016 recruiting cycles.
Both these slightly alternate points or angles we are discussing are correct. The O-Line problems of 2016 have developed over all these recruiting cycles of 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015 and even 2016 with the apparent Juco bomb outs. All this blame is fully on Bilelema except with regards to that 2012 cycle.
I just point more to the past because it takes time to develop most all SEC Lineman out of high school, usually at least two years with one being hopefully with a red-shirt. There are Shawn Andrews types but they are very rare and they usually land at the Alabama’s of this world, not at Arkansas. Andrews was an Arkansas native. However, you and the OP are totally right about these recent Jucos. They should step in & help this O-Line situation. That failure is totally on Bielema in 2015 & 2016.
You look at this current Bielema situation of struggling to get a ONE-DEEP SEC READY O-LINE in his fourth year here that will keep our QB out of the hospital. Any SEC team worth its salt would need a TWO-DEEP SEC READY O-LINE to ever seriously challenge for that SEC Championship Bielema use to talk about. THAT IS A SHEER FACT!!! This all just shows how damn far he is from ever achieving any championship. Four years. I don’t think he will do it in ten. He is a weak imitation of Nutt currently with a QB coach. He better keep Enos.